AMP Powerstep and possible remote operation if I can find a reverse ground signal

[Timmy]

Hello All,

Thought I'd turn to the community on this one. I installed new AMP powersteps so my kids and wife can get in the Jeep easier since it's a good jump up without them. They work great, fast, quiet, etc. etc. Well, take the doors off, and of course they don't work. Kids want the doors and top off 24/7 (I'm so proud of them.)

So I got thinking, the signal for the steps that comes from the door is just a ground loop signal. I'm hittin' the button on my key fob to "unlock" the car (even though there are no doors on) and the dome lights come on and stay on for a short time. LIGHT BULB!!! If I wire the door signal for the steps into the interior lights somehow, then I can extend the steps when I hit the key fob as I walk up to the Jeep, and they'll retract when the lights time out or I start the vehicle. In addition, I can turn on the interior lights and they will extend, which would work nicely if I pull up to a gas station and peep's need to get out, I just turn on interior lights, they extend, turn off lights after they are out while they run into gas station, then repeat when they come back.

Long story short, I contact AMP Research and ask if this is possible, would it hurt anything? Joe Ledezma responds back promptly, says go for it, won't harm the system, worst case is you'll blow the fuse. So, I get access to the footwell LED light and hold the wire to the hot on LED light, and steps extend. Hmmm... Turn interior lights on, and the steps retract. Wait a minute, right idea, wrong order. Obviously holding to the ground wire just extends them permanently. I think I know what is going on here and email Joe back to confirm. Sure enough he confirms, "the steps actually lower with a ground signal and raise when it loses ground. You would need to find a relay that reverses the signal at the switch." Okay, not sure how to resolve that one. Is there some nifty little gizmo/diode/whatever I could put inline that would flip/flop the signal on the hot wire to the LED lights? Is there a different wire I could tap that would accomplish the same goal that is located down in the footwell? It would need to be a wire that I can easily take off and put back on to the wire for the door signal when I put the wires back on. It needs to be a signal like the lights that stays on for a while so you can get in (ie. not like a door unlock wire that is just a one shot thing.)

Anyone got any ideas?

[Timmy]

Doing some research on solutions, I'm not REAL technical, but is this where a relay comes in to help? Is that what I need to put in line on the hot wire to the LED light, and then the other side of the relay connects to the powerstep signal wire and then to the ground wire of the vehicle?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz4X5umfNkQ

[JeepLab]

Good Video

[WhiteRavenRR]

I'm not sure on the relay. It might work but even if it did, would turning on the dome lamps while driving down the road cause the boards to lower? Do they have a power cut-off when the engine is running? That would be a cause for concern if they lowered while traveling. You might want to check into that.

[Timmy]

Yeah, if I can run to the auto store some time today, I'm going to try and grab as simple of a small relay as I can find (ie. one with only 4 poles on it) and try it out, unless someone replies back with another solution before then that has me go in a different direction. I was trying to think if I had any electronic equipment laying around the house that might have a simple relay in it that I could borrow real quick to test out, but nothing is coming to mind. Any chance the Jeep has some relays that are easily accessible that I could pull real quick for a test? My gut tells me this will work and it's probably a very cheap part at the auto store.

[Timmy]

Hmmm, aren't all the gray boxes in the fuse panel relays? I could probably just pull one of these for a quick test, right?

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[Timmy]

I'm not sure on the relay. It might work but even if it did, would turning on the dome lamps while driving down the road cause the boards to lower? Do they have a power cut-off when the engine is running? That would be a cause for concern if they lowered while traveling. You might want to check into that.

I had thought of that as well. Granted, if they lower while traveling with a 4" lift and 35" tires, unless off-roading, I doubt it would be an issue. Even when they are extended they are still within the width of the tires of the Jeep, and they are certainly still very far from the ground. In addition, I was thinking I could run a bi-pass switch to the dash, which I was going to do anyway like the Step-Slider rocker guards come with from Rock-Slide Engineering, so that even if I did have doors, I could prevent them from extending if I was off-roading.

[Timmy]

That would be a cause for concern if they lowered while traveling.

BTW... I wasn't entirely truthful in my desire for this option. I actually have heat seeking missiles located in the steps and I need a way to extend them while traveling so that I can blow up the stupid drivers in front of me, and then retract them so nobody will know where the missiles came from :cool:

[WhiteRavenRR]

BTW... I wasn't entirely truthful in my desire for this option. I actually have heat seeking missiles located in the steps and I need a way to extend them while traveling so that I can blow up the stupid drivers in front of me, and then retract them so nobody will know where the missiles came from :cool:

Now that's plausible deniability!

[Timmy]

Moooooo hahahahah, I have done it. Two $5 generic relays from the auto store and some wiring, and the steps now extend when I press the key fob unlock button and retract as soon as the dome lights go off.

[WhiteRavenRR]

Nicely done!

[Timmy]

Here's my quick right-up for anyone that has AMP powersteps and wants to do this when you take off the doors.

(I'm borrowing pics from all over the Internet so I don't have to go back out and take pics, please forgive me...)

Total install time after you have the parts is maybe 15 minutes.

Parts/tools required:
1) Electrical Relay for each footwell from auto parts store. Can be a 4 prong or 5 prong. At O'Reilly auto parts, they actually had a nice little packaged kit for $12 that included a 4 prong relay plus a by-pass switch, plus a number of different wires with the connectors on them already that slide on to the posts of the relay, have an end to attach to ground post, etc. (Blazer International - Relay Wiring Kit Part # MM510)
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2) If you didn't purchase the relay kit with wires and instead just a basic relay, then obviously you'll need some electrical wire and a way to attach them to the four posts of the relay. You could solder them on, or buy wires with the connectors on them.
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3) Qty 4 or 6 - Wire taps - to tap into the hot of the LED lights, and to connect the grounds together more easily. (Probably the red size is best, the blue's seem a little too big for the gauge wire used.) Depending on how you want to attach the AMP Powerstep door sensor wire, you might want to just tap it, or put a new connector on the end to connect to the posts of the relay (ie, this might be wire taps #5 and #6 if you chose.)
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4) Screw driver, ratchet, wire cutter.

Install

1) Remove the AMP Powerstep fuse if you still have it in. You don't need the steps extending on you while your working incase you prematurely ground the wire.

2) Located the LED lights under the footwell.
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3) Place a tap into the yellow cable shown in the picture (this is the hot wire leading to the primary LED light.)

4) Mount the relay on the 2nd ground post in the footwell area with the posts of the relay pointing up so they stay out of the way.

5) Place a wire on the 1st ground post in the footwell.
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6) Connect the hot wire from the LED light that you tapped to post #86 on your relay (all relays seem to have these numbers on them.)

7) Connect the ground wire on to post #85 of the relay.

8) Connect another wire on to post #30 of the relay and tap this on to the ground wire coming off post #85 (you could run this to the ground post in the footwell as well, but why run two wires, this way it stays nice and clean.)

9) Connect the "door sensor" wire from the AMP Research powerstep to post #87 of the relay. You could just tap the AMP door sensor wire that you already have into the door wire of the Jeep, but that'll probably get goofy when you put the doors on. I decided to simply remove the tap from the Jeep's door wiring for now and put a new end on it to connect to the post of the relay. (AMP includes a nice tap device that is a screw-on, so you can simply un-screw it, leaving the original tap on the main wire but pulling of their wire so you can re-attach it at any later date.)

10) Re-insert the AMP Research fuse.

11) Either push the keyfob unlock button, or turn on the interior dome lights via the switch on the turn signal stalk and see if the steps perform as expected.

Install Notes / Less Learned

- One thing I found helpful was to use a circuit tester at various points to confirm if the relay was working correctly ($9 part at auto store.)

- The el-cheapo relays from the auto store make a goofy vibrating noise when the LED lights dim at the end of their timer. Since a relay has a magnet in it with a spring, my assumption is that the magnet goes a little crazy as the voltage drops to zero. I think I'm going to research for either a solid state relay unit that is silent, or another mechanical relay that can better handle the decreasing voltage during dimming. Fortunately the powersteps still perform just fine as they have a built in delay, so it's not like they sit there and retract/extend/retract/extend until the voltage is at zero.

- I need to find a better way to deal with different wire taps for when the doors are on vs. being off. I could just leave the tap on the LED light like I have, however, that means both steps will extend when any door is open, whereas AMP has it setup so only the steps on the side of the door that is opened will extend/retract. For now though, since it's the start of summer, I don't really care as I plan on trying to leave the doors off for as long as possible :cool:

If you try this and have any questions, just ask. Probably not the best write-up in the world, and it was my first, but at least it is enough info to point you in the right direction.

[JeepLab]

Can we have a video?

[Timmy]

Video


http://youtu.be/xHpO-iC2Gjo

Told Joe @ AMP about this, he actually indicated they might consider this as a future factory option. I'm not sure how they'll get past the legal issues of the steps retracting based on a timer (might crush a babies leg/arm, not strong enough to injure anyone larger) or the steps going down while traveling. I'm sure if they get creative that they can link it to just the key fob and not the interior dome lights.

[JeepLab]

That is fantastic.

are the hinges below the step? That truck looks like you wheel it. Are you concerned about damaging it on a rock?

[Timmy]

That is fantastic.

are the hinges below the step? That truck looks like you wheel it. Are you concerned about damaging it on a rock?

Yep, hinges are below. In all honesty, even with the hinges, these actually do not really hang down any more than the original OEM Sahara steps. Certainly for the steps themselves (ie. not the hinges, or what AMP calls "linkages") they are actually higher than the OEM steps.

Yep, I wheel it a bit. I don't have a ton of rocks around here, so I'm not as concerned about rock hits. The actual power rock steps from another company can take a real hit, but the thing I didn't like about them was A) the price (they were like $1900) and B) the SLOW extension speed and noise. I really liked the AMP ones because they are FAST and pretty quiet, and obviously cheaper. Bestop has a line that looks similar, but their "wired" version has cheaper parts. Bestop's new NX line is nice because it uses wireless technology for the signal and it appears to use the same linkage as AMP (they used to be one company) but the motor is positioned differently and I'm not sure it's a Bosch motor. Of course, if it uses wireless, then you can do this cool remote key fob mod ;-) It's worth noting too that everyone has said AMP tech support is great, and I would agree. They emailed me back quick, and I swapped maybe 5 or 6 emails with a sharp tech there on a number of topics (not just the remote key fob idea.)

[Rexx19]

This is a very nice look.

Girlfriends around the world will thank you....

[Timmy]

Just a long-term update on this as I just had someone from the Interweb contact me requesting more info, so it got me thinking I should post some additional thoughts.

First... Yes, this still continues to rock. I can open up the back tailgate, steps go down, dump stuff in back and close tailgate and walk up to the front and get in before the steps retract. Girlfriends the world over have been coming up and thanking me, just as Rexx19 predicted :cool:

Second... I like that it is linked to the dome lights, as it helps you to remember if you accidentally left the steps down after driving off (if you use the manual operation of turning on the dome lights.) When you're driving down the road, even with the doors off, you can't see the steps are down unless you lean out, so you might have them hanging down and not know it. However, you will clearly notice if your dome lights are still on, which is a good reminder, so you'll turn them off thereby retracting the steps.

Third... I was originally going to replace the "loud" relays with quieter ones. As more time has gone by, I've learned to love those loud relays. It provides a nice audible input that the steps are about to be retracted. When you hear the relays kick in, it means you have 2 seconds to get your butt in, or get off the step, before they attempt to retract. The steps have a safety feature that ANY resistance at all and they stay down. So a few times I heard the relay go, then the steps tried to retract while my kids were still trying to get in. No harm done, the steps stayed down, and I just manually cycled them down and then back up and we moved on our happy marry way.

Fourth... When using the key fob, you have plenty of time. When opening up the back tailgate, it is a mix. I've noticed if you open the tailgate for a brief time, the dome lights don't stay on very long and thus the steps retract quickly. If you open the rear tailgate for a while (say more than a minute) then the dome lights seem to have a longer timer on them, and the steps stay down longer. In either case, if you need more time, just press the unlock button on your keyfob and you go into "bonus" time ;-)

[Charlie]

Timmy could you enlighten me as to how you connected your relays? I assume that the steps works when the doors are connected and also work when the doors are off.

[Timmy]

Timmy could you enlighten me as to how you connected your relays? I assume that the steps works when the doors are connected and also work when the doors are off.

I'm not sure I follow exactly on your question? I thought my write-up gave enough detail on the relay I used, the wiring I used, the connectors I used? Happy to help, but maybe get a little more specific if you would.

And yes, this solution will work with doors on or off. The problem with this solution when the doors are on is that AMP distinctly designed their solution to lower the steps only on the side that the door was opened on, and to retract as soon as the door is closed. By connecting to the dome lights, this solution will lower the steps on both sides whenever any door is opened (including the rear tailgate) and they will stay down until the dome lights go off. So as such, when you have your door and top on, it might appear the operation is a little goofy compared to what most people are used to seeing, however, the actually usage will still operate at the right time when you need them down to step on them. If you get the right type of splice though, it would actually be a snap to swap them from the relay solution here back over to using the wire for the doors. AMP included a nice wire tap that I had not seen before, that if utilized for both solutions (you'd have to buy more of course,) would allow you swap rather quickly, OR, you could get really fancy and put in a toggle switch that flip/flops between which solution you would use, that would be SAWEEEEEEET! Shoot, I may just do that. In fact, I may go so far as to put the button in the center stack set of buttons. If you did this, then in theory you could get away with just installing a single relay switch to control both steps instead of the two that I used (one on each side) and instead put your effort into installing the button. Ooooh, oooohh, ooooh, even better, you could get a lighted button that lights when the steps are down when used with the relay, then you'd have a nice visual (in addition to the dome lights being on) that your steps are down.

[MrWayneD]

Timmy; do you have the wiring diagram to using a 7 pin Carling switch along with the relay to be able to switch back and forth from key fob to "Standard" step operation

Thank you in Advance

[Timmy]

Timmy; do you have the wiring diagram to using a 7 pin Carling switch along with the relay to be able to switch back and forth from key fob to "Standard" step operation

Thank you in Advance

Sorry, I don't, but it would be cake to do. Basically put a switch in place that switches between using the dom light for the signal (via the relay I described earlier) or using the door open signal that AMP has you tap in to. You could accomplish this with a very simply three pin switch. Center goes to the AMP control head, top lead to dom relay, bottom lead to door. If you wanted to get fancy, you could put in a three position rocker switch that has an on/off/neutral setting so that when it's in neutral it is not connected to anything so that the steps would not lower at all (say if you were off-roading and jammed against a rock and didn't want the steps to retract at all if you opened the door.)

At first I thought I would want to move my signaling back to the doors and off the dome light when I put the doors back on. I've learned, I don't care. Dome light comes on when I open any door, steps retract, which is all I care about. The difference for me is that both steps retract versus just the step on the side the door opened. No big deal for me, it doesn't bother me, so I just left my wiring in place.

Hope that helps.

[MrWayneD]

Thanks Tim, I did call AMP and though he really couldn't help with a diagram, he stated that I would have to use diodes ( Ok above my pay grade) as the steps uses a negative ground to operate and taking it off the dome would require positive activation and that you would have to prevent back feed. Suggestion also was made to use the door locks as power. I just wish there was a clear diagram as to wire this and I agree with a SPDT lighted switch

[Timmy]

Thanks Tim, I did call AMP and though he really couldn't help with a diagram, he stated that I would have to use diodes ( Ok above my pay grade) as the steps uses a negative ground to operate and taking it off the dome would require positive activation and that you would have to prevent back feed. Suggestion also was made to use the door locks as power. I just wish there was a clear diagram as to wire this and I agree with a SPDT lighted switch

Diodes? That's crazy.. Just follow my original instructions for linking your AMP steps to your dome light using a $15 relay from the store. Once you have done that, you are basically there. Then you have my instructions for dome light, their instructions for using the door signaling. Last step, toss a switch between the two options to chose which signaling you want to use, they both do the same thing just at different times.

Also, linking to your door lock won't work because door lock is momentary. You need something that provides constant negative grounding. The dome light provides constant 12v positive, that's why we use a relay switch. It receives that 12v positive signal and charges an internal magnet that in turn close the gate leading to a ground signal thereby providing constant negative grounding the entire time the gate is closed (aka the entire time the dome light is on.) One REALLY fun thing with this solution (for when the doors are off) is that magnet goes bonkers when the dome lights "dim" down, so it gives this little buzzing sound that warns you that the steps are about to retract. Once it's done buzzing, you have 2 seconds to either hop in or press the unlock button on your key fob to give yourself "bonus time."

Here, I whipped up a pretty Visio diagram to explain it better. You could get fancy and go with a three position switch instead of the two position switch I described here. Then you could set it so position 1 leads to the door solution, position 2 goes to nothing and position 3 goes to the dome light solution. By doing that, you'll get a way to deactivate the AMP steps from retracting entirely by putting it into position 2 (basically neutral because you never connect a grounding wire to one of position two's leads.)

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[MrWayneD]

Thank you for all the help and info and sorry for the delay in my reply. I was away from the computer for a few days I guess now I need to put together the "Door Signaling, Dome light solution combined with the AMP Control unit with the switch diagram and try and make it work! Right?

Thanks
Wayne

[Timmy]

Thank you for all the help and info and sorry for the delay in my reply. I was away from the computer for a few days I guess now I need to put together the "Door Signaling, Dome light solution combined with the AMP Control unit with the switch diagram and try and make it work! Right?

Thanks
Wayne

Yep! I really think it will be easier than you think. Feel free to ask any questions if you get into it though and something's not working out. You JUST might inspire me to put this solution in my vehicle. I happen to have an extra switch that is waiting to be put into my dash somewhere.

[smbundy13]

thanks for the last diagram.. I am thinking of pulling the trigger on some steps soon and wanted a solution for doorless activation.

[BigKevSeattle]

Hi Timmy, I have a 2013 Rubicon and had a shop do my install today per your write up, which was very clearly written- thank you. However here is the problem. The dome light coming on does send my steps down, as well as just using the door to drop them. However, the steps will not go back up again unless I manually turn the dome light switch off. Otherwise they stay down and I get a message on my cluster that says "doors ajar" and "vehicle not in park". Once I manually turn the dome light off (which actually stays on unless I do so) everything goes back to normal. When I exit the vehicle the dome light comes on, steps drop, and if I leave for a while the dome light goes off and the steps are still down. Any ideas?

Thank you I advance!

Kevin

[Timmy]

Hi Timmy, I have a 2013 Rubicon and had a shop do my install today per your write up, which was very clearly written- thank you. However here is the problem. The dome light coming on does send my steps down, as well as just using the door to drop them. However, the steps will not go back up again unless I manually turn the dome light switch off. Otherwise they stay down and I get a message on my cluster that says "doors ajar" and "vehicle not in park". Once I manually turn the dome light off (which actually stays on unless I do so) everything goes back to normal. When I exit the vehicle the dome light comes on, steps drop, and if I leave for a while the dome light goes off and the steps are still down. Any ideas?

Thank you I advance!

Kevin

Hmmm, very interesting. In my particular situation, I did not wire my the steps to the door and the dome light at the same time. I only offered a solution that you could do this in conjunction with a manual switch to chose which you'd like to use for your signalling, either the door OR the dome lights, but not both at the same time.

Without seeing your setup firsthand... My gut reaction would be to tell you that you need to disconnect whatever wiring you have hooked up to the door wiring entirely. ONLY hook up to the dome lights. Once you have the system working with JUST the dome lights, then you can come back and try to get fancy by putting in a switch to toggle between the door or the dome for signaling (or neutral "off".)

Nothing about this procedure should cause the dome lights to stay on. The only way the dome lights are being used is to pull a tiny little draw off the hot wire of the dome lights to power the relay switch, which in turn grounds the signaling wire on the opposite poles for the Amp steps.

If you'd like, first disconnect your door wiring from the setup entirely and if still doesn't work as desire. If not snap a pic of your relay and get it over to me which will help me better understand your wiring.

FWIW... I have two relays, one for each step. I did this because I basically was replicating the existing setup where each step was grabbing it's signaling from each door independently. If I was to do it all again, I'd go with just a single relay switch that is then connected up to wiring for both steps at the same time. That way both steps are receiving the exact same grounding signal at the exact same time. Right now, one relay switch is just a HAIR faster than the other, so my steps deploy and retract at slightly different times. Now mind you, when I say a HAIR faster, I am literally talking maybe a 1/4 second at best. It's enough to bug me, but not enough to cause me to go re-wire it using a single relay (which honestly, would take, ohh, um... 10 minutes to toss a wire from say the drivers side to the passenger side?)

Also, another FWIW... I run my system off my dome lights exclusively. I originally thought I would switch back to using the door signaling when I put the doors on but I don't because it's not worth it. The OEM Amp solution allows the steps to deploy/retract independently of each other, and they don't retract when you open up the rear tail gate. In my solution, both steps retract all the time, no matter what door is open, and even if I unlock the vehicle while walking up to it. Big whoop, that tiny difference in how they operate was just not worth alternating between the two different signals based on when I have the doors on and off.

[BigKevSeattle]

Thanks man. Yeah they probably do have it wired to both the dome light and the door switch. I thought that may be the problem. I did verify he wired it like you mentioned to both relays. I'll let you know what happens. Thanks for the quick reply.

Kevin

[BigKevSeattle]

Hmmm, very interesting. In my particular situation, I did not wire my the steps to the door and the dome light at the same time. I only offered a solution that you could do this in conjunction with a manual switch to chose which you'd like to use for your signalling, either the door OR the dome lights, but not both at the same time.

Without seeing your setup firsthand... My gut reaction would be to tell you that you need to disconnect whatever wiring you have hooked up to the door wiring entirely. ONLY hook up to the dome lights. Once you have the system working with JUST the dome lights, then you can come back and try to get fancy by putting in a switch to toggle between the door or the dome for signaling (or neutral "off".)

Nothing about this procedure should cause the dome lights to stay on. The only way the dome lights are being used is to pull a tiny little draw off the hot wire of the dome lights to power the relay switch, which in turn grounds the signaling wire on the opposite poles for the Amp steps.

If you'd like, first disconnect your door wiring from the setup entirely and if still doesn't work as desire. If not snap a pic of your relay and get it over to me which will help me better understand your wiring.

FWIW... I have two relays, one for each step. I did this because I basically was replicating the existing setup where each step was grabbing it's signaling from each door independently. If I was to do it all again, I'd go with just a single relay switch that is then connected up to wiring for both steps at the same time. That way both steps are receiving the exact same grounding signal at the exact same time. Right now, one relay switch is just a HAIR faster than the other, so my steps deploy and retract at slightly different times. Now mind you, when I say a HAIR faster, I am literally talking maybe a 1/4 second at best. It's enough to bug me, but not enough to cause me to go re-wire it using a single relay (which honestly, would take, ohh, um... 10 minutes to toss a wire from say the drivers side to the passenger side?)

Also, another FWIW... I run my system off my dome lights exclusively. I originally thought I would switch back to using the door signaling when I put the doors on but I don't because it's not worth it. The OEM Amp solution allows the steps to deploy/retract independently of each other, and they don't retract when you open up the rear tail gate. In my solution, both steps retract all the time, no matter what door is open, and even if I unlock the vehicle while walking up to it. Big whoop, that tiny difference in how they operate was just not worth alternating between the two different signals based on when I have the doors on and off.

Timmy- one question. When you disconnect the door harness and remove the doors- the dome lights don't work- so how will they power the steps? I just unplugged the door harnesses and tried it. Nothing. Could this be due to them wiring to the door switch and the dome light circuit simultaneously?

[Timmy]

Timmy- one question. When you disconnect the door harness and remove the doors- the dome lights don't work- so how will they power the steps? I just unplugged the door harnesses and tried it. Nothing. Could this be due to them wiring to the door switch and the dome light circuit simultaneously?

What you are describing is not my experience. My dome lights still work even with the doors off. When I press the unlock button on my key fob, the dome lights come on with all the doors off. When I turn the toggle switch on my light stalk to turn on the interior lights, my dome lights come on, and then when I turn the switch off, my dome lights go off. When I open my rear tailgate, my lights go on and when I close the rear tailgate, the lights go off after a certain amount of time.

It is possible that if they wired the door signalling in with the dome lights to the same relay, that it might have really foobar'd something. Who knows, maybe it actually blew a fuse?

Seattle eh? I was over there with my Jeep just a few months ago. Do you ever make it over to Spokane?

I see you sent me PM. If you'd like, I can send you my email address via PM, though I suspect this discussion is worth having posted publicly to help others.

[BigKevSeattle]

I'm working with some contractors from Spokane right now. Carpita Construction. I'll pm you my number. Give me a call sometime

[Timmy]

I'm working with some contractors from Spokane right now. Carpita Construction. I'll pm you my number. Give me a call sometime

Cool! Sadly the east side of the state is a little limited on trails, but I'd be happy to take you where I can when you are here. We did a Black-Friday Jeep trip to a local area just after Thanksgiving, but man, the DNR put four Kelly humps in the path so we had to find an alternative route, which turned into following an ATV route to get around it all. To say my Jeep got scraped up would be an understatement. I really hate when the states block off access to our parks from off-road vehicles!

[BigKevSeattle]

So I would basically need to buy a switch that is On / Off/ On?


Diodes? That's crazy.. Just follow my original instructions for linking your AMP steps to your dome light using a $15 relay from the store. Once you have done that, you are basically there. Then you have my instructions for dome light, their instructions for using the door signaling. Last step, toss a switch between the two options to chose which signaling you want to use, they both do the same thing just at different times.

Also, linking to your door lock won't work because door lock is momentary. You need something that provides constant negative grounding. The dome light provides constant 12v positive, that's why we use a relay switch. It receives that 12v positive signal and charges an internal magnet that in turn close the gate leading to a ground signal thereby providing constant negative grounding the entire time the gate is closed (aka the entire time the dome light is on.) One REALLY fun thing with this solution (for when the doors are off) is that magnet goes bonkers when the dome lights "dim" down, so it gives this little buzzing sound that warns you that the steps are about to retract. Once it's done buzzing, you have 2 seconds to either hop in or press the unlock button on your key fob to give yourself "bonus time."

Here, I whipped up a pretty Visio diagram to explain it better. You could get fancy and go with a three position switch instead of the two position switch I described here. Then you could set it so position 1 leads to the door solution, position 2 goes to nothing and position 3 goes to the dome light solution. By doing that, you'll get a way to deactivate the AMP steps from retracting entirely by putting it into position 2 (basically neutral because you never connect a grounding wire to one of position two's leads.)

1647

[Timmy]

So I would basically need to buy a switch that is On / Off/ On?

If you are looking to control where you signaling comes from, the yes, just a simple switch to change your grounding source. You don't need a switch if you don't want it. It doesn't have to be a three position, it could be just a two position. I just tossed out the idea of a three position because then you can effectively turn "off" the signaling all together, say if you were off-roading and you didn't want your steps to ever retract.

[BigKevSeattle]

So , switch aside, I took it to another shop today to get them to work off the dome light. They couldn't get it to work either. Printed out your step by step instructions and they still had the same problem. Steps would go down with dome light and then wouldn't go back up unless you manually turn off the dome light with the tree.

[Timmy]

So , switch aside, I took it to another shop today to get them to work off the dome light. They couldn't get it to work either. Printed out your step by step instructions and they still had the same problem. Steps would go down with dome light and then wouldn't go back up unless you manually turn off the dome light with the tree.

If you can take pics and post them here, I can probably help more. It's hard to help without seeing pictures of what was done.

You mention the steps would go up if you manually turned off the lights with switch on the turn signal stalk. So when the dome lights go off on their own, after a bit of time, the steps don't go up? That is odd, odd, odd. What is different with the lights turning off on their own versus turning off via the manual switch? I just can't see a difference. I mean, the lights either have power to them, or they don't! How can cutting the power to the lights via the switch produce a different result than the lights losing power due to the timer turning them off?

Anyway, get me a picture of the relay switch they put in, as best as you can given it will probably be in tight quarters. I'd say post it here in the forums versus sending it to me in a private message as obviously the more we can publish for all to see, the more others can be helped out by this.

[Timmy]

So , switch aside, I took it to another shop today to get them to work off the dome light. They couldn't get it to work either. Printed out your step by step instructions and they still had the same problem. Steps would go down with dome light and then wouldn't go back up unless you manually turn off the dome light with the tree.

You know, in looking back, I see I don't have a diagram of what the relay switch would look like without the switch in place. Obviously getting this working without the switch is primary, so maybe if I whip up a diagram of what that would look like so you can get that working first, then the adding a switch later would be easier. Let me see what I can put together.

[Timmy]

Okay, here's a little diagram. Now, a WARNING!!! I'm creating this from memory, so I may not have the correct wires on the correct posts of the relay switch, but this should get your installers close. I was able to figure this out with nothing but a $5 circuit tester that I would either ground or attach to a positive signal and then touch various parts of the relay as I had the relay hooked up to the ground or amp signaling wire. The point is, any installer worth their salt should be able to look at this, grab a relay, grab a circuit tester and figure it out if what I have drawn up here is not 100% accurate, because the idea itself is so damn simple it's retarded. You have a relay that receives a signal, the relay in turn activates an internal switch that completes the circuit on the opposing posts. When you complete the circuit on the opposing posts, you complete it to a source and destination that you want paired together, (say a signaling wire to a ground, as in our example here, though it could have been external lights positive wire to a 30amp positive feed from the battery so the lights turn on.)

Hope this helps, and as I said before, send me pics of your relay switch and I'll try to help out more.

1683

[BigKevSeattle]

Got down and looked at it. I see the problem. They tapped into the factory door harness with the trigger switch and also into the relay. Going back there this afternoon so they can disconnect from the door harness and reconnect the wire from the dome light and just have the trigger wire going directly to the relay and only the relay. That should solve the problem

[BigKevSeattle]

It worked. They had the door harness and the relay both wired to the trigger switch. Thanks for all your help. Next time you're over the mountains beers are on me lol

[Timmy]

It worked. They had the door harness and the relay both wired to the trigger switch. Thanks for all your help. Next time you're over the mountains beers are on me lol

Nice job!!! That is awesome that you were able to just look at it and realize what they did wrong.

I will totally take you up on that beer the next time I'm over there! (even if it's like a year later, so don't forget me!!! grin.) In the same regard, if you're here in Spokane, just let me know and I'll be happy to buy you a drink.

[BigKevSeattle]

What killed me was I was very clear with both shops about NOT connecting to the doors wiring harness, and they both spent so much time on it I assumed they did what they were told. The minute I crammed myself down in the footwell I saw what the problem was (thanks to you of course). I'm not going to worry about the switch. If I need to disable the steps it can be done with the dome light switch. This is the perfect setup as is. Besides the buzz of course. Lol. I'll get used to it.

Thanks again man. Keep on wheelin'.

Kevin

[Jacob]

Stupid question but this is driving me mad!! I have gotten the passenger side to work, but cannot seem to get the drivers side to work. Did you tap into two separate yellow wires (one on the passenger side and one on the drivers side?) If so, where is the drivers side wire located?

[Timmy]

Stupid question but this is driving me mad!! I have gotten the passenger side to work, but cannot seem to get the drivers side to work. Did you tap into two separate yellow wires (one on the passenger side and one on the drivers side?) If so, where is the drivers side wire located?

Well for starters, you can control both steps at the same time from one relay switch. So if you have the relay switch working on the passengers side, just attach the drivers side amp control cable to the same part of the relay that you did with the passenger side. You don't have to mess with putting a relay switch in on the drivers side like I did. Looking back, I should have just wired mine with a single relay switch that controlled both steps of the LED footwell light.

As for your actual question. You tap into the 12v lead to the LED footwell light for your signal for the relay switch. For the AMP step, you have to pull the driver's side signal cable over from the wire loom on the passenger side to the drivers side just like the AMP manual shows. In other words, get the entire system working according to the AMP instructions. Once you have done that, swapping from the signaling from the door signaling to the LED lighting signaling just uses the directions I've already posted.

[Timmy]

SMALL update.

I JUST put a relay switch in-line with the AMP head power and connected it up to my SwitchPro's 8100 8-switch system and now I can disable the Power Amp steps with the push of the button. I've found that when I go out mudding that if you prevent the steps from retracting while they are caked in mud that they will perform much better when you get home and spray them off before using them again. When they are constantly going up and down while caked with mud, too much mud gets in to all the moving parts and can stop them from functioning correctly. Previously I was pulling the fuse prior to going mudding to disable the steps. I always wanted a way to disable the steps via a button inside the Jeep so I don't even have to open up the hood. Now I finally have that. My next upgrade is going to be either using my SwitchPro's switch or another dedicated toggle button to toggle the input source between the door signaling versus the dome lights. That will make it easier when I take the doors on and off as then I can just toggle the switch to use whichever input I desire instead of having to physically re-wire the signaling from the door vs. dome light.

[Timmy]

What killed me was I was very clear with both shops about NOT connecting to the doors wiring harness, and they both spent so much time on it I assumed they did what they were told. The minute I crammed myself down in the footwell I saw what the problem was (thanks to you of course). I'm not going to worry about the switch. If I need to disable the steps it can be done with the dome light switch. This is the perfect setup as is. Besides the buzz of course. Lol. I'll get used to it.

Thanks again man. Keep on wheelin'.

Kevin

So BigKev, it's been a year since you did the dome light mod. How's it working? Have you come to love the sound of the buzz of the relay switch and how it's like a little 2 second warning to the steps being retracted?

[BigKevSeattle]

So BigKev, it's been a year since you did the dome light mod. How's it working? Have you come to love the sound of the buzz of the relay switch and how it's like a little 2 second warning to the steps being retracted?

Hey Bro! How's it going? Actually that buzz went away after a few months- steps are still working great! Saw your post about the steps in muddy wheeling- I just turn mine off by rotating the switch all the way to the back, turning off the dome lights. Easy squeezy! Hope all is well with you.

Kevin

[Timmy]

Hey Bro! How's it going? Actually that buzz went away after a few months- steps are still working great! Saw your post about the steps in muddy wheeling- I just turn mine off by rotating the switch all the way to the back, turning off the dome lights. Easy squeezy! Hope all is well with you.

Kevin

The buzz went away? That's crazy. The buzz is caused by the dome lights having the voltage reduced to create a dimming affect when turning off. Maybe you have a relay switch that has a magnet that is just not as sensitive to this. Maybe my relay switch was too cheap! (ha!)

Ah yes, of course, if you are running strictly off the dome lights and can already control it, then my little solution would not be needed. I have wired back to the door signaling when the top/doors are on and I'll switch back to the dome lights when the doors come off.

I needed a solution because our Jeep family grew. My daughter saved up enough money for her first Jeep and now she wants to go Jeeping all the time!

1752

[BigKevSeattle]

Sweeeet!!!!!!

[Timmy]

Sweeeet!!!!!!

Very sweet, and my son wants a Jeep for his first vehicle as well (in about 2 years)!

Sadly... her Jeep is 1" taller than mine (we both have 37" tires) and she reminds me of this EVERY day. Hmm, might be time to try out some new Metalcloak dual rate 4.5" springs I've been eyeing ;-)

[baron_conrad07]

Sorry,, I am new to this.. is the yellow wire underneath passenger footwell? Is it the wire that connects the light for the footwell? Anyone please help.. thank you

[Timmy]

Sorry,, I am new to this.. is the yellow wire underneath passenger footwell? Is it the wire that connects the light for the footwell? Anyone please help.. thank you

Hopefully this will help.

1753

[krawaterway]

Timmy, thank you for your detailed steps on this. I want to make the switch to dome light trigger for doors off, but I want to retain the original configuration with doors on (ie independent operation based on which door is open). I am trying to think through a switch diagram that would accomplish this.

So far I have:

Doors On
Left step sensor connected to left door signal
Right step sensor connected to right door signal

Doors Off
Left step sensor and right step sensor both connected to right dome light signal

It think I see how to do it with two switches:
switch 1: either the door signal OR dome signal connects to the step sensor
switch 2: either the left step sensor is connected to the left door signal OR the left step sensor is connected to the right step sensor which is connected to the right dome signal

Does this seem correct to you? Can you see a way to do this with one switch?

Any help is greatly appreciated.